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Author Topic: Trapeze exit help  (Read 3907 times)

Free

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Trapeze exit help
« on: December 07, 2010, 11:28:28 AM »

Hi, I've learned to land a trapeze but getting out of it cleanly and quickly is another story. I was watching How to be a Player and at one point Steve says (while in a trapeze hold) "just wait for it to correct itself." ? Maybe thats a bearing king or rip cord balance difference? I'm using the Guilia and if I wait anytime at all it rotates toward the crown down not toward tip down. I have to activly move my string in the dirction of the tip. If I chase the tip around for 7 or 8 seconds it will correct itself and I can pop it back to my hand.
When I watch everyone else do it, you pull in one direction and pop it back to hand, very quick and smooth. I can not figure out how to correct that quickly nor can I leave the top on the string because it just falls off crown first. It doesn't sit on the string at an angle like I see in the videos.
Is there a difference in fixed vs. bearing?
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ta0

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Re: Trapeze exit help
« Reply #1 on: December 07, 2010, 12:34:52 PM »

Perhaps you are watching the wrong video  :P
The Spinology video shows what you need to do: pull the top straight in the direction the tip is pointing so it makes a big vertical arch: it will stand up.

Alternatively, you can also do what you are doing right now but hurrying the top by moving your hand in a circle and forcing it to precess faster.
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Mark Magyar

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Re: Trapeze exit help
« Reply #2 on: December 07, 2010, 12:36:22 PM »

http://www.topspinning.com/tricks/trapeze.html

I'll try to give you better detail later on when on home computer.
Hopefully the link is helpful though.
Gyroscopic procession.
Better definition of this in Spinology video.
but when the point/tip is pointing to your non trowing hand swing/move the string in that direction to straighten up the top back to your hand.....   
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Neff

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Re: Trapeze exit help
« Reply #3 on: December 07, 2010, 02:42:17 PM »

There are a number of incorrect passages in How to be a Player Vol. II
I was a mere spin top apprentice at the time...
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Mark Magyar

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Re: precession
« Reply #4 on: December 07, 2010, 03:37:46 PM »

Gyroscopic Precession

PRECESSION – Introduction to:
Grade Levels: 6-8
1. Yo-Yos. First, perform the following experiment with a ball-bearing TigerShark yo-yo (by Spintastics).
a. Throw a hard Spinner. Watch it spin.
           a. Does it stay in the same plane of spin while it is spinning?
b. Throw it multiple times. Notice that even though a throw may be
somewhat crooked, the spin stays in the plane from which it was throw (at least until the spin dies).
c. Now remove ONE of the “speed rings” from one side of the yo-yo. (To remove it, pop off the holographic side disk on one side of the yo-yo and remove the metal ring you find inside by lifting up from under it with a screwdriver or other such tool.)
d. The yo-yo is now OBVIOUSLY out of balance. If you were to throw a Spinner again, what do you predict will happen? Do you think it will tip over on the heavy side?
Why or why not?
e. TRY IT! Throw a hard Spinner and watch the yo-yo spin. What happens?
  What you should see happen is that the yo-yo will begin to turn toward the
weighted side, but will not tip over, as you may expect. This is called precession. It will stay spinning in the plane from which it was thrown, due to gyroscopic stability.
  This proves that when a yo-yo is spinning in a crooked manner, it is NOT due to the yo-yo being out of balance. It is because the player is not throwing the yo-yo straight.
(Sorry!)

 Gyroscopes.
  A simple visual to show precession is a gyroscope. Pull the string in a gyroscope to spin the wheel inside of it. Loop the string around one end of the gyroscope and let go of the other side. Does it fall? No! Would it fall if it were not spinning? Yes!
  However, how is it spinning? It isn’t just spinning as it is stationary on the string.
It is actually turning around the string axis. Why? This is precession, as explained below.

 Spin Top.
  A Spin top is another form of a gyroscope, and therefore will precess in the sameway as a gyroscope when spun and hung on a string.

Gyroscopic Precession   says that a spinning object tends to react to a disturbing force by rotating in a direction at right angles to the direction of the force. In this case, the disturbing force is the weight of the heavier side of the yo-yo. Thus, instead of falling the direction of the weight, precession causes the yo-yo to rotate at right angles to that
pull, or toward the side of the yo-yo which is the heaviest.

What demonstrations in the Science of Spin assembly showed precession?
- Gyroscope hanging on the string was turning.
- Spinning top hanging on the string doing Rock the Baby was turning.
------------------------------------------------------------------
From Dale Oliver of Spintastics
Science of Spin program

Dick Stohr who is a member here
is a part of the Science of Spin program.
Maybe he can help explain more about gyroscopic procession.
And I would like to learn more about the Science of Spin program…

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Mark Magyar

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Re: Trapeze exit help
« Reply #5 on: December 07, 2010, 04:06:48 PM »

There are a number of incorrect passages in How to be a Player Vol. II
I was a mere spin top apprentice at the time...

Um, yes... maybe a few incorrect passages. It took me a while to re-learn how to do a trapeze for me to be comfortable to catch it on the string every time. Well, almost everytime.  In Duncan video vol.2 it shows a side mount throw which makes the point face towards you when catching it on the string. More difficult to catch and not as accurate as regular trapeze throw with thumb on point when throwing and point facing away from you when catching. Even though Duncan R~C might be a slightly larger top, I can still do a regular trapeze throw with it. I can also do a regular trapeze throw with Spintastics Grande Trompo as well. I don't do that many trapezes these days after figuring out there's different ways of getting the top sideways on the string for doing rock the baby, hop the fence, around the world, drumbeats, etc...

the Duncan How to be a Player vol. 2 video is still a very good introductory instructional video for its time...
I still watch the video from time to time.
I like the freestyle...
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Free

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Re: Trapeze exit help
« Reply #6 on: December 07, 2010, 05:08:52 PM »

Wow that's a lot of info to digest! Thanks Mark. I guess I'll have to really watch what I'm doing tonight to see whay I'm doing to cause it to tip backwards off of it's plane. So what you're saying (or Dale is saying) is that if I catch the top at 90 degrees to the string it should stay there and not fall off it's plane toward it's crown?? So I'm holding the string wrong or something, huh, well I'll keep watching what I'm doing. Maybe I'll figure it out.
Thanks again.
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Dick Stohr

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Re: Trapeze exit help
« Reply #7 on: December 07, 2010, 10:42:38 PM »

Not exactly.  If you do not move your hand the top will slow and start to fall.  If you pull the top by the tip in the direction of the tip it will slow and try to stand up.  So the trick to keeping the top level is to pull the tip around at a speed that will counteract the forces that are trying to let the crown of the top go below horizontal.  Hope that helps, most of it is a feel thing.
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Practice hard and play safe.

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Re: Trapeze exit help
« Reply #8 on: December 07, 2010, 11:09:40 PM »

Thanks Dick. I've had some better success with it tonight. I'm able to correct much faster and I even popped it up and caught it back on the string once or twice and I pulled off subway a couple times. It does help to know that it won't correct itself and that I'm supposed to be moving it a bit.
I threw Corkscrew for an hour and a half straight....the cork is still in the bottle :o Oh well, I'm close to getting that one.
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