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Author Topic: Got Milk (jugs)?  (Read 63202 times)

ta0

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Re: Got Milk (jugs)?
« Reply #60 on: December 14, 2012, 11:22:07 AM »

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i wonder if stepping down the heat would effect how much the plastic shrinks...
also i wonder if when you start to melt the plastic, if you did it at a slower rate over a longer period of time, i wonder if it'd have fewer air pockets/voids...

Slow cooling may give bubbles more time to get out. Also avoids internal stresses that could separate the material and create air pockets. On the other hand, the final shrinkage is given by the end temperature and the material, not by the rate of cooling.


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If Ta0 won't add a like button to this forum I"ll make my own! ;)
If I added the button people would be too lazy to post.  ;)
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the Earl of Whirl

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Re: Got Milk (jugs)?
« Reply #61 on: December 14, 2012, 03:06:42 PM »

His work is seriously impressive!
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Happiness runs in a circular motion!!!

johnm

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Re: Got Milk (jugs)?
« Reply #62 on: December 14, 2012, 09:32:56 PM »

rereading this thread all i can think about is that i wonder how slowing down everything having to do with heat would effect the tops being created...  i wonder if stepping down the heat would effect how much the plastic shrinks...
also i wonder if when you start to melt the plastic, if you did it at a slower rate over a longer period of time, i wonder if it'd have fewer air pockets/voids...

and on a somewhat different note: who cares if it makes a thorough proper mix or not: i think you should try mixing higher densities of materials with lower densities of materials... a sponge form built around/within/through a sponge form... if i were you i'd be finding out what happens when i mix different hotglues with the milk bottles and other things you've been melting...

For melting, the most effective way to reduce air trapping is by adding small amounts of material at a time to minimize the trapping events and minimize the material through which any trapped air must travel to escape.  Degassing the melt with vacuum before adding more material also helps.  Of course injecting a continuous flow of melted material would be better.

For cooling as ta0 commented, the thermal contraction is a function of temperature so the high temperature at which the form is assembled is what controls the amount of contraction experienced.  Because my mold is square and not round, the cooling can be nonuniform with the metal corners holding more heat than the narrow sides.  Thus stepping the temperature down slowly reduces the variations around the top and helps promote uniform shrinking but does not reduce the amount of shrinkage.

The HDPE plastics I’m using have close but varying densities.  A thorough or proper mix of multiple colors helps with a uniform distribution of mass which promotes better balance for the top.  If PE plastics of significantly different densities are mixed (like some HDPE with some LDPE), the different thermal contractions result in inconveniently textured surfaces.  Mixing different types of plastics with significantly different melting temperatures may result in decomposition of the one with the lower melting temperature when subjected to the high melting temperature of the other one.  Additionally the various plastics may not bond to each other.

There are lots of possible improvements to test and think about, however, most of them take more time to implement and increase the time and effort required to make a top.  One thing I hope to eventually try -- based on some descriptions from Spinningray about reinforcing his large tops on the inside with (I think) fiberglass -- is to melt the plastic with some type of cloth liner becoming embedded in the plastic.

In general though, my process already requires an absurd amount of time to produce a flawed top which still requires machining to clean it up and make the cap fit the body not to mention the tip.  As long as there are great playing tops for $20 (or even $100) available, this technique is a ridiculous way to get a top to play with.  I do it because I have more time than brains and get some satisfaction from the process.

Then I found out about the requirement list, and my hopes of ever getting one fell...... I wonder if it would be possible to have an international requirements list... something one can fulfill without having to live in the US?  ::)

I recognize the geographic/economic discrimination created by my requirements to ‘earn’ one of these tops, however, my willingness and motivation to invest the time and effort to fabricate these tops is to provide a token somewhat unique 'thank you' to those spintop enthusiasts willing to commit their time and travel expenses to visiting and supporting top spinning in Ohio, particularly my favorite event in Miamisburg.
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czyoyo

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Re: Got Milk (jugs)?
« Reply #63 on: December 14, 2012, 11:42:27 PM »

Fair enough. :)

I'll just have to admire the pics for now. ;)
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the Earl of Whirl

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Re: Got Milk (jugs)?
« Reply #64 on: December 15, 2012, 11:00:41 AM »

Thanks johnm, for that good explanation about all the things you go through for your tops.  I have seen it and I have thought about it but it still makes me appreciate my "buckeye top" all the more.  Of course, as I always say, when you have bad tops you can't do anything with or old scraps, the Hall of Fame will always be glad to take them to add to your exhibit!

Also, thanks for your plug of our event.  We are hoping the 14th one on the 24th of August in 2013 will be the best yet!!!
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trompillo

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Re: Got Milk (jugs)?
« Reply #65 on: December 16, 2012, 03:33:19 PM »

It is an incredible work, I admire his work and understand his way of awarding his tops,
We will continue dreaming many of these nice tops, :'(
« Last Edit: December 16, 2012, 03:35:54 PM by trompillo »
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Shootist

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Re: Got Milk (jugs)?
« Reply #66 on: December 16, 2012, 09:50:12 PM »

Hey Mike "The Earl of Whirl"

Save me and Eli a spot at Bullwinkle's, may have to make another Ribs and Spintop run to Miamisburg, Ohio. 
« Last Edit: December 17, 2012, 12:01:26 AM by Shootist »
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the Earl of Whirl

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Re: Got Milk (jugs)?
« Reply #67 on: December 17, 2012, 08:25:09 AM »

Looking forward to another visit from Shootist and Company.  People took our event more seriously when I told them that spinners were coming all the way from Alabama to attend!  If all goes well, I hope to see you twice next year......at worlds and in Miamisburg.  That would be another good year like 2012!!!
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bAd

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Re: Got Milk (jugs)?
« Reply #68 on: December 17, 2012, 10:16:05 AM »

Then I found out about the requirement list, and my hopes of ever getting one fell...... I wonder if it would be possible to have an international requirements list... something one can fulfill without having to live in the US?  ::)

I recognize the geographic/economic discrimination created by my requirements to ‘earn’ one of these tops, however, my willingness and motivation to invest the time and effort to fabricate these tops is to provide a token somewhat unique 'thank you' to those spintop enthusiasts willing to commit their time and travel expenses to visiting and supporting top spinning in Ohio, particularly my favorite event in Miamisburg.

Aaaallright.... I guess the impossibility for us to have one, despite how much we would like to, is exactly the point... Our drooling is demonstrating and highlighting exactly how exclusive they are...  ;D
Fantastic work, hopefully I'll be able to at least SEE one, sooner or later!  ::)
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the Earl of Whirl

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Re: Got Milk (jugs)?
« Reply #69 on: December 09, 2014, 10:29:09 AM »

Waiting for plumbers to come and working around the house today so I am taking the opportunity to continue my work with HDPE.  I am happy to have found this thread again to try to better understand this material.  I have made several clumps of HDPE, trying for the shape of a cylinder so I can turn it on a lathe.  Some of my finger spinner tops have come out in pretty good condition and some have had some substantial air pockets.  Still, people seem interested in what I am doing when I show them my wood and HDPE creations.

Has anyone else tried working with this material.  It is especially good to play with it on a cold day and while something is cooling, to use the heat it gives off for comfort!!!

My youngest son will be here in a week and we have talked about attempting some fun things with this while he is here. 
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the Earl of Whirl

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Re: Got Milk (jugs)?
« Reply #70 on: December 15, 2014, 10:53:45 AM »

It is kind of interesting to cut out designs from this material and melt it to other pieces.  I made a couple snowmen plus a giraffe!
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the Earl of Whirl

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Re: Got Milk (jugs)?
« Reply #71 on: December 22, 2014, 04:45:32 AM »

My granddaughter loves the snowman and the giraffe.  Yet, I think what she likes more than anything is the display of three Ohio State colored tops made by johnm.  Each one is a different size and she plays with them several times each day.  She has been overheard to talk to the big top as if it is the dad with the medium size top as the mom and the smallest top as the baby!

Another one who loves my plastic bottle creations is our dog, Gracie.  She thinks that every cylinder of HDPE I make for the lathe is something I have made for her.  I have let her have a few of them and she loves to prance around with it and then chew on it for a while before I rescue it for its real purpose.
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ta0

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Re: Got Milk (jugs)?
« Reply #72 on: December 22, 2014, 12:38:51 PM »

I love to hear about this new facet of The Earl as a craftsman . . . a top/toy maker!  8)  8)  8)
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cecil

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Re: Got Milk (jugs)?
« Reply #73 on: December 22, 2014, 01:39:45 PM »

More small Tops. Very nice work. Mold is the best way to go.
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Jack

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Re: Got Milk (jugs)?
« Reply #74 on: December 22, 2014, 05:04:32 PM »

My granddaughter loves the snowman and the giraffe.  Yet, I think what she likes more than anything is the display of three Ohio State colored tops made by johnm.  Each one is a different size and she plays with them several times each day.  She has been overheard to talk to the big top as if it is the dad with the medium size top as the mom and the smallest top as the baby!

Another one who loves my plastic bottle creations is our dog, Gracie.  She thinks that every cylinder of HDPE I make for the lathe is something I have made for her.  I have let her have a few of them and she loves to prance around with it and then chew on it for a while before I rescue it for its real purpose.

sounds like paradise on earth
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