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Author Topic: Peg top progress log of ortwin and random questions  (Read 17142 times)

Texture

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Re: Peg top progress log of ortwin and random questions
« Reply #105 on: June 27, 2022, 10:12:13 PM »

Progress: I was just able for the first time to perform a  corkscrew with a fixed tip top!
The YYF Short Circuit  was the top used for this.

Congrats! Technically you could say you can regenerate now, since the corkscrew with a fixed tip actually regens a bit.


question:is there a "right" way to do the trick "around the world".

From my understanding there are three different tricks called around the world: The around the the world from the trapeze, where the top is swung once tow the left or right, around the world from the hand, which is similar to the one from the trapeze but the top is dropped from the hand, and the lateral around the world, which is around the head.

I tried to do that today. In most of my best tries the top left the string after about 1/3 of the circle. Once I  managed the full circle but the return to the hand was not quite as it should be.

The key is the direction the tip is facing. The way most people do the trick is to wait for the tip to face away from you on the trapeze, and the to swing the top to the right (in your case it would be to the left since you are left handed)
Ta0 could probably explain the way the trick works much better than me though.  :) 


Now I looked again at this video from Chris Neff:
He does it not from a trapeze, but from a boomerang. That "could" be easier, not?

When I first saw this version and tried it as a beginner I thought it was very difficult if not impossible....  :-\
But I'm sure to other people this version might even be easier. The tough part is making the top turn to it's side when you back it off from the hand.
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ta0

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Re: Peg top progress log of ortwin and random questions
« Reply #106 on: June 28, 2022, 01:17:27 AM »

Progress: I was just able for the first time to perform a  corkscrew with a fixed tip top!
The YYF Short Circuit  was the top used for this.
Actually this was not even on my list and I found it to be almost easier than with the bearing tops. Maybe it is that the tip of this top goes better with the string than the tips of the other tops I tried?
Congrats! When the trick was invented in 2000 by Lao Alovus it was assumed for a while that it was only for bearing tops. The difference in execution is that with the bearing top you swing your arm to help the top circle around the arm, while with fixed tip you keep the arm still and let the top go around. Unless you are trying to regenerate with the fixed tip, in which case you swing it (a mouth guard is recommended).

I tried to do that today. In most of my best tries the top left the string after about 1/3 of the circle. Once I  managed the full circle but the return to the hand was not quite as it should be.
The key is the direction the tip is facing. The way most people do the trick is to wait for the tip to face away from you on the trapeze, and the to swing the top to the right (in your case it would be to the left since you are left handed)
Texture is correct, the key is the direction the tip is facing when you start the swing. But you also have to consider how fast are you going to swing it around. If you are swinging it very fast, you wait until the tip almost points in the direction you are going to swing it. If you swing it slower, you start at an angle before it points in the direction of the swing. If you swing it very slow, you start when the top points away from you (or alternatively towards you if you swing it in the opposite direction).
Because the top of a left-handed player precesses opposite to a right-handed player, the rules above mean that if both start the trick with tip facing away, they swing in opposite directions: clockwise for a righty, counter clockwise for a lefty (as seen from the player's point of view).
« Last Edit: June 28, 2022, 01:40:22 AM by ta0 »
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ortwin

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Re: Peg top progress log of ortwin and random questions
« Reply #107 on: June 28, 2022, 02:35:57 AM »

.... in which case you swing it (a mouth guard is recommended). ...


A mouth guard might not be enough unless it guards your full face! The other day that wooden top from Rocco hit me right on the nose when I was trying to do the corkscrew with it. Luckily no injury and also my glasses survived. But I switched to the lighter and safer Short Circuit for that trick.
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ortwin

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Re: Peg top progress log of ortwin and random questions
« Reply #108 on: June 29, 2022, 04:49:42 AM »

Progress: I was just able for the first time to perform an "around the world" from a trapeze!


Thank you Texture and ta0 for the tips!


A "Short Circuit" was the top I used.
Threw the trapeze with the left hand, waited until the tip was pointing towards me. Then waited a bit longer, the tip pointed a bit to my left. Swung it quite fast clockwise as seen from my perspective.
After reading ta0's directions a few more times I come to the conclusion that I followed them in the successful tries. Still confusing all this directions, so easy to get it wrong, yet so important to do it the right way (even as a lefty)!
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ta0

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Re: Peg top progress log of ortwin and random questions
« Reply #109 on: June 29, 2022, 08:47:36 AM »

Well done!

The rule is pretty simple: swing in the direction the tip is about to point to, the closer to this direction the faster you swing.

I have seen people swing in the direction of the crown: although it's possible, I don't think it works very well.

I came up with this rule when I started doing multiple around-the-worlds, one of my very first tricks. To be valid, you have to start it before the string wraps around the tip. My record with a Gates JJY top was over 20 revolutions, going as fast as I could. The tricks Hitchhiker and the Boleadoras (Bolas) came out of this. I also use this rule when I do the around-the-world with Figaro.
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Bill Wells

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Re: Peg top progress log of ortwin and random questions
« Reply #110 on: June 29, 2022, 11:54:01 AM »

Progress: I was just able for the first time to perform an "around the world" from a trapeze!

Congratulations, Ortwin. What, no video of this accomplishment?
Not sure this trick is something an uncoordinated octogenarian should try.
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ortwin

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Re: Peg top progress log of ortwin and random questions
« Reply #111 on: June 29, 2022, 05:05:45 PM »

...
Congratulations, Ortwin. What, no video of this accomplishment?
Not sure this trick is something an uncoordinated octogenarian should try.
Thank you Bill! But nooooooo, "the first time success" of a trick is never on my videos. I only get a camera for the tricks if I have a bunch of them from my list that I feel comfortable with, meaning they are solid enough to work at least once in lets say five attempts.
Thank you also for my new English word of the week! I had to look up "octagenarian".
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ortwin

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Re: Peg top progress log of ortwin and random questions
« Reply #112 on: July 16, 2022, 04:07:35 PM »

Progress: I was just able for the first time to perform an "Upside Down Merry Go Round".
I did it from half a gyroscopic flop as Texture showed in that video, and I used my brand new Sweetle top from Chris Neff (in bearing mode of course) for the trick.


I am still practicing to do it the ta0 way that Kirk showed in his video, but there must be a certain thing I do wrong most of the times: mostly the top just falls down from the string as soon as it has some clear tilt downwards. There must be something wrong the way I am doing it. It can be the radii of the circles I let the top perform, or the speed, or the phase, or some ratio of these quantities or something completely different.


Anyways, there is still one trick on my  "goals for bearing tip top" trick list that I haven't done yet: "hop the fence". I had that in the fixed tip list but I moved it over to the bearing tricks. Mostly because it would be very hard (3 repetitions) with a fixed tip and also Chris Neff shows the trick in his ladder video with a bearing tip top. That leaves "Lasso" and "Whip" undone in my fixed tip list, plus of course the regenerations.

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ta0

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Re: Peg top progress log of ortwin and random questions
« Reply #113 on: July 16, 2022, 08:35:13 PM »

Congratulations on your progress!

For the upside-down merry-go-round, you have to accelerate a bit when the top tilts. But always keep the crown pointing to the center of the circle.

I would probably put the Whip on the bearing list first, as you will have more time to prepare.
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ortwin

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Re: Peg top progress log of ortwin and random questions
« Reply #114 on: July 17, 2022, 01:19:51 PM »

... But always keep the crown pointing to the center of the circle....


"That sounds as I might be 90° off with the phase angle. Very good advice, and easy to correct. I will get it right the next time I work on it!" At least that is what I thought when I read your post. After trying to apply it, I still think it is good and correct advice, but it seems it takes me longer than expected to implement it. Maybe I practiced the "wrong way" too much.

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ta0

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Re: Peg top progress log of ortwin and random questions
« Reply #115 on: July 17, 2022, 05:03:03 PM »

Let me clarify what I said. You push the top towards the crown to make it fall. Once it's at the right angle, you have it make a circle with the tip pointing slightly to the outside and the crown towards the center, the opposite of a regular MGR. At that point you probably want to pinch the string closer to the top with your non-throwing hand to make a smaller (and faster) circle.
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ortwin

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Re: Peg top progress log of ortwin and random questions
« Reply #116 on: July 18, 2022, 05:29:18 PM »

Alright, now I was able to do it two or three times the "ta0 way".
It is not very solid yet, but getting better. The crucial moment is definitely when the top is at a right angle. The change of speed and phase and string length in that phase still needs to become automatic just right.
I found a video of Mike Hout just yesterday where he does it riding a unicycle!!!



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the Earl of Whirl

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Re: Peg top progress log of ortwin and random questions
« Reply #117 on: July 18, 2022, 10:10:56 PM »

Ha ha!!!  What an honor to see my name in your thread.  Yes, I have many good memories of that freestyle.  First of all, I could hardly find any time when the stage was empty to practice.  I waited and waited and finally got on early one morning when a couple Japanese players sat down on the front edge and let me do my thing.  Oddly enough, I had nothing but bad practices before the freestyle.  I was sure I was going to bomb out and make a fool of myself.  I was stunned and quite relieved when it was all over.  Top freestyles are notorious for being worse than one expects.  That one was WAY better than I could imagine!!!
« Last Edit: July 18, 2022, 10:14:07 PM by the Earl of Whirl »
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Kirk

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Re: Peg top progress log of ortwin and random questions
« Reply #118 on: July 22, 2022, 09:03:26 AM »

Alright, now I was able to do it two or three times the "ta0 way".
I'm glad that my video helped.  Great Progress!
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paxl13

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Re: Peg top progress log of ortwin and random questions
« Reply #119 on: August 03, 2022, 12:11:13 PM »

I absolutely love your Topic title :) Just just missed the fact that I can't write in english LOL
I had to plural the "random"

I'm too silly,
Cheers
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