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Author Topic: future world spintop contests  (Read 4992 times)

Kirk

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Re: future world spintop contests
« Reply #15 on: September 18, 2016, 04:10:05 PM »

The rules are not detailed on purpose. The trick set for a freestyle is large and not settled. The sport is evolving and there is still lots of space for creativity. I don't think we could make a list of tricks with points for each trick. You have also to understand that the judges are clicking the tricks in real time. Many times we have less than a one second to figure out what the player did, if we have seen the trick, how difficult is the trick and if it has it been done before during that routine.
Yes a complete list would be impossible.  However most of the tricks we have seen before.  For planing a routine it would be good to know if a trick was worth enough points to be worth the time to execute.  For example corkscrew takes a while to set up.  Would I be better doing 2 around the worlds or one corkscrew?  Should I risk the trick X that I am 90% or go with a more reliable trick?  Are the point values similar to sport division (aka ladder)?
..., in which the players submit the routines beforehand ....But I don't see spintop players doing this  ::)
Heavens No!  Some of us barely got our music submitted in time. :)

Just out of curiosity how does a judge score amazing tricks like a wire walker to foot or a release sun?
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the Earl of Whirl

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Re: future world spintop contests
« Reply #16 on: September 18, 2016, 05:25:09 PM »

"For example corkscrew takes a while to set up.  Would I be better doing 2 around the worlds or one corkscrew?"

Good comment!!!

"Just out of curiosity how does a judge score amazing tricks like a wire walker to foot or a release sun?"

Good question.
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ta0

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Re: future world spintop contests
« Reply #17 on: September 18, 2016, 09:19:43 PM »

Yes a complete list would be impossible.  However most of the tricks we have seen before.  For planing a routine it would be good to know if a trick was worth enough points to be worth the time to execute.  For example corkscrew takes a while to set up.  Would I be better doing 2 around the worlds or one corkscrew?  Should I risk the trick X that I am 90% or go with a more reliable trick?  Are the point values similar to sport division (aka ladder)?

The old sports division trick points is a good indication of the possible value ranking of the different tricks on the list. Be aware that the perceived difficulty of tricks may change over time as some tricks get better known are more common.
A simple corkscrew (with a bearing tip out of a boomerang) is currently considered basic at the freestyle level and will only gather 1 point in my score sheet. So it is probably not worth doing (2 around the worlds will probably also give you one point). In general, long setup tricks are not good for scoring even if they are difficult. On a 3 minute routine you can put one of those (for variation and as a breather) but I would recommend not more that one.

Quote
Just out of curiosity how does a judge score amazing tricks like a wire walker to foot or a release sun?
I generally score tricks from 1 (basic) to 6 (very difficult and risky). I think Dale has the same range, although he generally ends up clicking about double than I do. But it does not matter: the total scores of each judge are normalized.
If Austen had nailed the wire walker to foot, I would have given him either 4 or 5 points because of the originality of the trick (first time I had seen it and also very showy). I am sure I gave Eli for the sun with release at least 5 points.
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Neff

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Re: future world spintop contests
« Reply #18 on: September 18, 2016, 09:34:12 PM »

For planing a routine it would be good to know if a trick was worth enough points to be worth the time to execute.  For example corkscrew takes a while to set up.  Would I be better doing 2 around the worlds or one corkscrew? 

The time it takes to setup and execute a regular corkscrew is not worth it in a freestyle. If you really want to develop a high points freestyle you have to spend some time composing it, getting rid of setup time and working flow between every trick you can land 75% of the time at least. I spent about 3 months on mine, about 3 to 5 hours a week.  I believe studying the points to be far less important than practice and composition.

In a show of course, you gotta do corkscrew, the public loves it.  If a yo-yoer did Walk the Dog and Rock the Baby in a championship freestyle that would be a complete waste of precious seconds, but those tricks are not included in a public show the audience feels jipped.
« Last Edit: September 18, 2016, 09:37:16 PM by Neff »
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Dick Stohr

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Re: future world spintop contests
« Reply #19 on: September 18, 2016, 10:05:51 PM »

The second is stop counting the first 5 regens as five different tricks.

I thought that we stopped counting any trick after 5 to prevent just racking up points by doing to same trick over and over etc. plus it is just boring.
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ta0

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Re: future world spintop contests
« Reply #20 on: September 18, 2016, 11:04:13 PM »

The second is stop counting the first 5 regens as five different tricks.

I thought that we stopped counting any trick after 5 to prevent just racking up points by doing to same trick over and over etc. plus it is just boring.
Yes, we stopped counting after 5 repetitions.
What I am trying to say is that perhaps we should count the 5 like one single trick that is not worth 5 times the trick done once. Or perhaps limit it to 3 consecutive repetitions and 6 non-consecutive?
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Jack

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Re: future world spintop contests
« Reply #21 on: September 19, 2016, 12:16:43 AM »

If a yo-yoer did Walk the Dog and Rock the Baby in a championship freestyle that would be a complete waste of precious seconds




ms. connolly did that at eyyc 2012 @-@
started with a walk the dog she did @-@
mustnt question connolly.......mustnt question her @-@

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=igwr1cz8pTg

i kid i kid  ;D
« Last Edit: September 19, 2016, 11:00:20 AM by ta0 »
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the Earl of Whirl

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Re: future world spintop contests
« Reply #22 on: September 19, 2016, 07:21:01 AM »

I have to admit, she is quite the charmer.  She comes out on stage with a big smile and looks out at the audience regularly during her routine.  Very impressive stage presence.  I could learn a lot from her.  Maybe even Eli could pick up a tip (Eli the announcer eating dog).
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Taka

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Re: future world spintop contests
« Reply #23 on: September 19, 2016, 07:44:11 AM »

I didn't see all threads,but reply first comment.

We always have same discussion in Yoyoing. Even yoyo contest,hard to communicate with out side of community.No yoyo player understand rules,and only judges know the rule,and even read rule,can't understand how to get/give points.Just inside judges know everything.

I like the idea longest spin or target shoot,etc.It can be "sports".

And "freestyle",it is hard part.First of all,all of competitor need more skill,I think.Just few player can do freestyle in the world,so far.I am not.

Here is the good example.We have "Kendama" freestyle as new culture and they learn from yoyo and but did not do same rule,make their own style.
http://www.gloken.net/en/w-cup/201605031617/

They picked up "tricks" from players and set point,and easy to understand rule.

Their goal is not decide "Freestyle" champion,but expand community with same page.Freestyle is too free,sometimes hard to compete with same division.
And they also work with City,media,so need to build up "understandable" rule for General people.

Kendama is new culture and only Japanese people play more than 40th years as "sports".So to compete with all over the world people,they need new rule.


dear all

jim
any input is welcome
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