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Author Topic: string placement on crown???  (Read 1376 times)

ryan paul

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string placement on crown???
« on: May 14, 2016, 01:36:19 AM »

 i see people tie the string around the crown both ways. position 1 (clockwise) is if the top is  standing  the knot is pinched and string whipped around the left side then back around the right hooking the knot and down to wrap. thats position 1. so in position 2 (counter clockwise) with top standing the knot gets pinched and string whipped around the right so that when it comes around the left it flows right over the knot and down to wrap. which position is right? why?
« Last Edit: May 14, 2016, 04:35:09 AM by ryan paul »
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Kirk

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Re: string placement on crown???
« Reply #1 on: May 14, 2016, 01:55:04 AM »

99% of the time it does not matter. I used to wrap the crown clockwise (I'm right handed) but I found I could  change my grip more easily if I wrapped the crown counter clockwise.  I only matters on tops that have a lathe turned groove at the base of the crown. (Mostly older tops)  A long loop will help prevent string snags in this case.
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Dick Stohr

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Re: string placement on crown???
« Reply #2 on: May 14, 2016, 02:41:08 PM »

On tops equal to or less in size than the grande I tie a loop big enough to place the knot in the same place that I would place the knot without the loop. So it makes no difference right or left. Larger tops or larger string/rope I do not use the loop. It again comes down to personal preference, what ever feels good and works well for you.
« Last Edit: May 14, 2016, 02:43:09 PM by Dick Stohr »
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ta0

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Re: string placement on crown???
« Reply #3 on: May 14, 2016, 05:36:15 PM »

99% of the time it does not matter. I used to wrap the crown clockwise (I'm right handed) but I found I could  change my grip more easily if I wrapped the crown counter clockwise.  I only matters on tops that have a lathe turned groove at the base of the crown. (Mostly older tops)  A long loop will help prevent string snags in this case.
I agree with Kirk. And the observation about the vintage (1960's Duncan wood) tops is a good one.
I think most players wrap counterclockwise if they are right-handed, which produces a more natural wrap. I got accustomed of doing it the other way, clockwise, but I don't think I am 100% consistent.
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studio42

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Re: string placement on crown???
« Reply #4 on: May 14, 2016, 05:48:50 PM »

I wrap the crown counter-clockwise. It's how I was shown to do it. I think the wraps around the body itself are far more important anyways since those are what causes the top to spin.

The last bit is responsible for flipping the top over, right? It shouldn't  make a big difference at that point.
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Dick Stohr

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Re: string placement on crown???
« Reply #5 on: May 14, 2016, 07:29:35 PM »

I think what makes the top flip is the last wraps to come off (at the tip). I think the wrap at the crown is only to allow a tight wrap. I have seen tops thrown where the knot is held by the thumb near the largest circumference then the string goes directly to the tip and then wrapped as usual. The top flipped as expected. Do the scientist here have a better explanation ????????????????????
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Kirk

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Re: string placement on crown???
« Reply #6 on: May 14, 2016, 10:57:31 PM »

You are correct Dick.  Any change of spinning angle will come from putting a force on the top's axis that is away from that is away from the center of mass.  So the tip is the most common location to pull on the top's axis.  The pull on the string gets closer and closer to the tip as the string unwinds during the throw. Many players can make the top dance well without knowing all the math.
Kirk
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ta0

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Re: string placement on crown???
« Reply #7 on: May 15, 2016, 11:29:43 AM »

As Kirk says, what matters is the position at which the string is pulling with respect to the center of mass, as that determines the torque that flips the top.
When you start the throw the wrap is high so the string is pulling close to the center of mass. However, the top at that point is spinning slowly so it is easy to turn. Towards the end of the throw the sting is pulling close to the tip so it is applying maximum torque. However the top is spinning fast so it is difficult to turn (and it will turn at 90 degrees due to precession). In practice the start of the pull seems to be what flips the top: if you have a tall wrap and the start of the pull is close to the center of mass, it does not flip.
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