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Author Topic: Regarding to workout aerobic top.  (Read 3290 times)

Ketzaltlipoka

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Regarding to workout aerobic top.
« on: September 06, 2009, 09:30:42 PM »

I saw and read all these messages and was imposible to me to resist the temptation to write, because this is a very interesting topic and I just want to express my opinion.

-My teacher Gustavo taught to me that the most tired trick, the one in which you get tired a lot, are the Orbits. The orbits was the second one cuerda I got,the first one I learnt was lazadas and the second one were the orbits. The first way in which I got them, was strange. In fact, I guess that all the people that learns orbits, at the beggining, do them equal, in the same way...We can call this style..mmm..."the hesitating way to do orbits" because it seems that the top is just about to fall, and specially, because, you move your chest and head, and shoulders to back (hacia atràs, I mean) when the top passes in front of your face.  I told to ta0, that the style of Gustavo, is impressive...I`ve got one video from him (last year,...2008.., sometimes he allowed to me to record him, in order I could notice better the way for improving my game. ) and when he do them, the tops it seems to be on a perfect straight line while you see him in front of him).

 Even, he was able to show me the way I did them (when I could understand how to regenerate, and, consequently to do the trick non stopping) and the difference with his way to do them (orbits). He`s a person who prefers to be....how can I say this idea..mmmm?....hidden...not to show too much his game in videos of internet. Of course, I can`t upload my videos where he appears, without his permission.

After, I was able to understand the proceedure to do orbits, and I get why they are so diificult, and why oneself gets tired when you do them.
Even more difficult are left middle orbits (for a right-handed man). more difficult and even much tired. I even thought that was impossible to me do that.
Personally, I guess that middle orbits (right and left) are harder and more tired that complete orbits.

Sometimes, you sweat from the head when you do these tricks (I speak by myself , my own experience)

- As far I used to know (some from months ago) the orbits are called in USA (magnetic wires, that means in spanish "cables mágneticos") ta0 explained to me in a mail the reason of this. In fact, I like this denomination...magnetic wires. I believe to know, that the "medias òrbitas were called by Pulp, "single satellites" and the òrbitas "doubled satellites".

 I imagine, that Pulp named this way (AND BY THE WAY, PULP; IT WASN`T NECESSARY YOU TAKE DOWN YOUR VIDEO)...( I think it would be better for me don`t say anything about this of taking down videos...) ...because the Cometa players and others mexican players, they like to call to òrbits, like "satèlites".
As far as I know, according with some talks with ta0, òrbits, doubled satellites (by the way, Killswitch, nothing to do "satèlites" with "èlites" ((I only say this to avoid misunderstandings in language))) ) and magnetic wires are differents names for one same trick.
Òrbitas, Doubled satelites, and magnetic wires are the same. Is it correct or not this aprecciation, ta0?

-By the other hand, in regarding with the topic that begins these topic,something about if oneself do
corporal exercise by playing top, my personbal opinion is that is much more than that.
Not in all the tricks, but some are so intensive that...you must take a rest.

-Reversibles are one of them. You move all the body and turn and to catch the top. When you get i-into rythm, you start to sweat.
-Orbits, of course, and middle orbits too.
-If you do continuosly the trick in which you combine lazadas and putting the top on your back, turn your body and another lazada, almost immediately stars to sweat.
I might say more tricks, but,
 no doubt, (at least by my personal experience as a spintopplayer) the most impressive, exhausting,
tired, sometimes infuriating, trick of top, are Mandalas.
I told ta0 that this is one of the top top tricks. We can say that this one is the King of the exercising tricks of top. You feel how all your body get enter into action. If it`s said that swimming is the most complete exercise, I can say that this is the most extreme exercising trick.
You move all your legs, since foot to ship, your stomach, your chest, your back, your arms, your head.
You need to extract all the energy from the fibers of your body and that effort is so supreme and marvelous. You start to sweat, and inhale harder more air...and like the major price...your heart starts to beat,..beat...faster and faster like if you were ruuning fastly. ((by the way, some drawings of tops, look like hearts))

Resuming, I believe that to play top (and others kinds of juggling) is a very complete exercise.
Physical (I mean, corporal, related to body, the muscles) mental (related to mind, you control both hemispheres of your body) and spiritual. The pace and quietness, relax, and harmony you get by playing top, is incredible.
You equilibrate body, mind and soul playing this ancient, amazing and marvelous toy. (top is almost equal to toy)

In the other topic, I apologize unto you if I took my videos down. If in determined instant I am too much sensible, sensitive...if I see something which dislikes me, just there my reason gets dark and I don`t bethink my decisions.
In some future time,..maybe,  I will upload more videos of top,
 





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agentsac

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Re: Regarding to workout aerobic top.
« Reply #1 on: September 06, 2009, 10:29:55 PM »

I was playing with my top outside all day today and I worked up quite a sweat. I have asked some of my friends who yo-yo why they don't throw tops, and they tell me that it requires too much physical labor. That is the reason why I love it! And I appreciate even more when I am able to go outside and enjoy the fresh air and beautiful scenery.

I was also working on my orbits and I am ashamed to say that my game needs improvement but I will keep practicing and someday I hope I will be able to do them.

Also, your reason for taking down your videos is your own and you don't owe anyone an explanation. Just promise that you will at least post a message here from time to time.

Welcome back and thanks for your opinion.
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ta0

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Re: Regarding to workout aerobic top.
« Reply #2 on: September 06, 2009, 10:42:59 PM »

Nice to see you back posting on the board, Salvador. I am sure everybody here is sorry you took down those videos. As you told me by email, you uploaded them directly from your camera and then erased them, so they are lost. Unless somebody downloaded them to their computers: could we be so lucky? (baldufado?) (perhaps in a temporary file on the hard drive? I need to check mine.)

The right half-orbits require a more complex movement than the full orbits. However, I succeeded with them (right half-orbits) first because they are more effective at regenerating. My guess is that is because in the full orbits you lose a lot of spin on the long back side of the orbit. I believe what you say about the names of the tricks is correct. Daveid had not named his "regenerating blizzard-type" trick at World 07 when I pressed him to do it. He first named it magnetic string but "wire" was better. The inspiration for the trick came from a video of Gerardo that we could only explain if the "blizzard regenerated."

The more arduous exercise with tops is roller-coasting . . .  a giant top! Specially if it is thick-walled Figaro! That's why I like to have it set for bearing  :D One day you will have the chance to try it.

(I just saw the last email you sent me, answering many questions, thanks a lot. But I still have to answer half of your previous email .  .  . ;))
« Last Edit: September 07, 2009, 12:08:50 AM by ta0 »
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poptop

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Orbitas medias izquerdas
« Reply #3 on: September 07, 2009, 01:47:48 PM »

AAraGH.  These half orbits/single sattelite are tough!  I get two or three once in a while, but I still don't really perform the correct motions.  I seem to be having just a little more luck with smaller tops for this one.  I'm going to get it eventually...

I have been playing a med-large solid oak Japanese Koma lately that is about 5 1/2 in tall and 3 1/2 in wide--not huge, but the biggest top I have.  It's not only a vigorous excercise, but with the angled, "tetrahedral" steel tip, I play it with a maeasure of fear.  I was playing in the grass yesterday and it took a bloody bite out of my big toe!  Ouch.

Salvador, the people here who share your passion for spinning tops appreciate your videos and are grateful to have them as a resource to help inspire us and improve our play.  It would be great to find a way to keep them available for those of us who need the help.  Maybee Ta0 might consider adding to his tao.com trick library video submission from players who want to demonstrate tricks and such?  I know the videos Ta0 made have helped me and many others.
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Erratic Wobbler

jim in paris

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Re: Regarding to workout aerobic top.
« Reply #4 on: September 07, 2009, 02:06:02 PM »

(re) salut salvador !

je suis vraiment content que tu sois de nouveau parmi nous

bonne analyse du magnetic wire ;-)

what you say about the physical and mental skills involved in topspinning is also valid for various activities
magic , guitar , yoyo, juggling etc...to name a few...
 : many tricks depend on timing , on doing the moves in the right order, and then you have to make your brain go as fast as  you can or you lose control :::---))

have you ever tried" big tops" for reg tricks ....?

they look so much great on stage ! (tom C at worlds, or eric's "big throw")

keep in touch , partner
salut mec!

jim





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ta0

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Re: Regarding to workout aerobic top.
« Reply #5 on: September 07, 2009, 02:19:16 PM »

The idea of having videos from Salvador in the trick tutorial section of ta0.com is something we had discussed and were planning to do. I want to start working on that section soon (well, sometime this year after I catch up with a few other things.) There will be many more tutorials from beginner tricks to the cuerdas from Salvador (he tells me he has a couple of new ones, already!) It does take some work to have a tutorial that is complete and looks good. One advantage of having retired from competition is that I don't have the pressure to keep "any secrets" (something that I always tried to avoid but . . .)

By the way, it seems André will finally dig out the files Rich gave him from the old B&S board. That is great news! Greg has offered to port them to topspinning.com (or an upgrade he is planning). I'll make sure they really become available by also porting them to this board.
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Pulpowsky

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Re: Regarding to workout aerobic top.
« Reply #6 on: September 07, 2009, 04:56:33 PM »

Thanks Salvador for your comprension about my fast-thinking names of the tricks performed in the Trompos cometa team video. I speak a lot with Salvador de la Rosa and the other Salvador and Miguel Angel too, but I dont speak about the names of the tricks, so that I invented the names with the few information I had. I have no idea about the trick's inventor.

Gracias Salvador por tu comprensión por los nombres puestos rápidamente en el video de trucos realizados por el team de Trompos Cometa. Hablé mucho con  Salvador de la Rosa y el otro Salvador (no recuerdo su apellido) y también con Miguel Angel, pero apenas hablé de los nombres de los trucos, por lo que les puse unos nombres que con la información que tenía consideré eran lo más acertados posibles. No tenía ni idea de quién había inventado esos trucos.


I retired the video to remastericed it with the correct names but time is rare to me now and I espect to do it in October.

Retiré el video para rehacerlo con los nombres correctos, pero ando escaso de tiempo y espero hacerlo en Octubre.


I think you do more effort with the Huitzime quetzalcoatl regen trick, at the end you are very tyred.

Yo pienso que hiciste más exfuerzo con la cuerda Huitzime quetzalcoatl al final del video se aprecia estás cansado.


Personally I become wet trying to perform "the automatic", specialy when I try to raise the speed of the top.

Personalmente me hace sudar bastante el intentar de forma continua ensayar "El automático" especialmente cuando intento incrementar la velocidad del trompo.
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Ketzaltlipoka

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Re: Regarding to workout aerobic top.
« Reply #7 on: September 09, 2009, 02:15:46 PM »

Thanks to all , ta0. agentsac, poptop, jim, and pulp.
Yes, agentsac, I  promise saty here time on time. Ta0, give time and those vides will appear as soon as I am free from tasks. The same to you, Pulp and Jim.
Poptop, all the time I was waiting your email and never came. I repeat you that I sent it to you at your gmail address (as you told me to do this) Don`t worry.
 
Pulp, the tiredness (cansancio) in every trick is different. In huitzime Quetzalcoàtl (hummingbirds of Quetzalcoàtl) is not so the physical effort by itself, but the maximum concentration that the trick requires. And sometimes, is more intense the mind wearing -out (desgaste) than physical, than corporally.
I will show you in one next soon video, one trick of this sort.
Is combining a serie of atomos with a mandala.
The precision must be absolute and too a tired one. But is so beautiful.!!


Give time and in the rest of the week willl be there, (because not only you, (((here, from USA ))), but people in another countries have answered me about the videos of top. A child send me an email that he is so sad because my videos are no longer there.
This really makes me sad.
Give time.
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the Earl of Whirl

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Re: Regarding to workout aerobic top.
« Reply #8 on: May 13, 2019, 08:26:03 PM »

Hmmmm.  An interesting thread about something in which I am always interested.  I am surprised I never responded to this.  I am always looking for effective ways to exercise while spinning a top.
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paxl13

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Re: Regarding to workout aerobic top.
« Reply #9 on: May 14, 2019, 08:10:56 AM »

@Earl :

Play with a big enough top and snapstarts your ways to wirewalker and orbits :P I sweat quite a bit and I only play with small tops :) But yeah, throwing tops doens't require much energy... snapstart and regen however :)

Funny tho I was thiking this same thing that, orbits do require quite a bit of work while on other hands, sewing maching to single sun to seweing maching to... don't... Funillly I almost never obits anymore, I always suns :)

Anyway, tops can be a workout :) I remember how badly I was sweating when I started snapstarting :)
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